City Council - Jeanne Robb, District 10

The result of an e-mail vote in the Cherry Creek North Neighborhood on the issue of Fillmore Plaza was approval, by a small margin, of a much improved plaza-street hybrid design from the one presented in July. With the support of the leadership of the Cherry Creek East Neighborhood, the Country Club Neighborhood and CHUN, CCNNA leadership worked with the Business Improvement District to further refine the design.

What’s new in this design:

• Parking has been removed from the entire north end of the plaza to allow a more pedestrian feel.  There will be 5 spaces on each side of the south end of the plaza near First Avenue.
• The center of the plaza and all of the area north of the center will be curbless, creating a very open feel when the area is closed.  There will be retractable bollards for closing the plaza to traffic and for delineating the auto/pedestrian areas when it is open.

The following elements of the design remain:

• Special pavement treatment from building face to building face, sidewalk and street.
• Lush planters with trees on the south end of the Plaza to block noise from First Avenue
• A central event space with a removable high shade structure
• Narrow traffic lanes that allow but don’t encourage traffic

The key programming elements include:

• $600,000 of event infrastructure for sound, lighting, and other mechanical
• At least 35 days of closures and events – including Sundays from May to September, 4 neighborhood/community days or evenings, and 5 3^rd party requests, etc.
• A 50% increase in the BID’s budget for events in 2011

The next step will be for the BID to turn the conceptual design into actual construction design and to start through the city review process.  As with all projects, the City will review the safety features, the utilities, drainage and so on.  All the necessary agreements about maintenance, liability, limited parking, and events and closures will be legally formalized in an Inter-Governmental Agreement between the BID and the City.  While Council will have to approve the IGA, it was important to be sure that there was substantial agreement from the neighborhoods about moving forward before investing all the time, effort, and money on final drawings and the review process.

Click here to view the proposed design.

Open Space Issues

• Question: If we dedicate our only large open space to traffic, what open space will replace it?
• Question: We are being asked to give up Fillmore Plaza as open space. What are the developers who will benefit directly willing to give back to the district?
• Comment: Fillmore Plaza is the only area where a “park-like” mood can be created in CCN. We should not give it up! After hearing both sides, I will question whether a hybrid is still really possible…

Response: Fillmore Plaza is dedicated right-of-way in Denver, as are most sidewalk and streets. However, unlike most other right-of-way, it is paid for and maintained by the Cherry Creek North Business Improvement District – not by taxpayers. 

The CCN BID also pays for the maintenance of the First Avenue Medians as well as all the sidewalks, lighting and corner planters with benches in the area.

Fillmore Plaza was developed to bring retail shoppers from the Cherry Creek shopping mall into the CCN district; it was not developed as a park. Parks in the area include Manley Park by Bromwell School and Pulaski Park along Alameda and Steele in Cherry Creek East.

Since the businesses and property owners paid to create the plaza and will pay to convert it to the “hybrid” street, I’m not sure they have an obligation to give something else back. But we all have an obligation to create a public space that works for the community and for the   businesses.

• Question: Is a “hybrid combining both street and plaza/open space” really possible?”

Response: Not sure. It probably depends on dimensions and if it’s ever closed to cars.

• Question: Could there be hours like 9 am to 5 pm for traffic so that the space is “open, auto-free space” at some times?

Response: This depends on the terms of any agreement/ordinance.

• Question: Has there been any discussion of having an “off-leash” dog fenced dog area as a way to draw pedestrians to Fillmore Plaza?

Other Malls 

• Question: Who maintains the 16^th Street Mall? 

Response: There are rather complicated agreements between the Downtown Business Improvement District and RTD because the 16^th Street Mall is a transit mall. RTD pays for maintenance and improvements in the transit way and the BID is responsible for maintenance and improvements on the sidewalks.

• Comment: Pearl Street in Boulder attracts shoppers from Denver & visitors from everywhere because of unique character of shops, etc. destination outdoor mall. Fillmore could be that for Cherry Creek! Plus a street would kill shopping center shoppers from coming over.

Response: Clayton Lane does not prevent shopping center shoppers from crossing at Clayton. As to Pearl Street, see answer below.

• Question: Instead of talking about pedestrian malls that have failed, why don’t you research the successful ones and help us copy those? 

Response: On this website, you will find a list of the successful, surviving malls as well as photos of these, provided by the Denver Planning Office. As the Planning Staff pointed out all of these successful malls are in locations of very high density, college towns, or resort towns. Check out this link about the Santa Monica 3^rd Street Promenade: http://www.nytimes.com/1992/01/05/travel/santa-monica-s-urban-living-room.html?pagewanted=1

Design/pedestrian Issues:

• Question: Two lanes of traffic/two lanes of parking. How much sidewalk for tables and chairs? Will this be enough?
• Response: Sorry, I don’t have an answer yet, but will post it as soon as I get it.

• Question: Is there an opportunity to submit another design for the plaza?

Response: Tough question. It’s nigh on to impossible to design by committee. Nonetheless, the design could and should evolve.

• Question: Has there been a study of pedestrian traffic flow in the district – entry and exit points? 

Response: The only study I know of is the number of pedestrian crossings on First Avenue which was done by Fehr and Peers. Hopefully, the BID will post those numbers on their website. The greatest number of crossings is at Clayton Lane.

• Question: What constitutes a private street? Every time I turn down Clayton from 1^st Avenue, my granddaughter tells me to stop – “Can’t you see this is a private street?”

Response: If something about the design of Clayton Lane, tells you or your granddaughter that it’s not as conducive to auto traffic as other streets, then the pedestrian/auto balance becomes stronger. Hybrid streets ideally give the impression that cars are not the main focus.

• Question: How would the Fillmore Plaza hybrid street compare to Clayton Lane – which was billed as pedestrian friendly.

Response: Clayton Lane is a private street. It was the Sears parking lot before it became a private street. As a private street, neither the BID nor the City controls its closure.

As to dimensions, the width of the street section in Clayton Lane is approximately 5-6 ft. wider than the section currently proposed for Fillmore. The Fillmore hybrid has narrower lanes and wider sidewalks. As proposed, Fillmore will also have a unique shade structure in the center.

Events/Activation:

• Question: Denver has many inactive public spaces – Civic Center being the largest. What will activate a pedestrian plaza? If the answer is events, the space lacks organic activity and will fail again. So what will change this?
• Question: For the Plaza option closed to traffic, what will attract people to the plaza on a regular basis not just for event?

Response: Yes, pedestrian plazas probably do need programming to be active. Pioneer Square in downtown Portland, OR, is surrounded by streets and retail but still has to program daily events to activate the area.   They have a full-time events staff and a very large budget. So the hybrid should be more active on a regular basis, but the fear is that the events won’t occur - without some sort of commitment from the BID. 

• Question: How does a 3 year plan to study events help us now? And who will bear the costs of closing streets, etc.?

Response: Ideally, we would establish an event schedule before a decision on the hybrid street model is made. The BID would bear the costs of closing streets and planning events, unless a private entity wanted to hold an event there and then that entity would probably bear the costs.

Retail Issues:

• Comment/Question: What makes Larimer Square a success are the many excellent restaurants and clubs. If Fillmore becomes a hybrid street

What’s the chance of attracting that kind of merchant/restaurant?

• Question: How many times is Larimer Street closed during the year (it was referenced as a comparable)?

Response: I spoke briefly with Joe Vostrejs of Larimer Associates. They no longer hold Oktoberfest (which they used to hold in September). It is not closed even as much as it used to be.

• Question/Comment: Isn’t Cherry Creek an activity Center? What’s missing on the plaza is lack of diversity.   Need places to live (we have that), work (we have that also), shop (we have some of that), dine (none), play (none). Can’t the BID/developers use creativity to include dining and play activities in the Plaza/Hybrid?

Response: Makes sense to me.    

• Question: How do rents on Fillmore relate to Third Avenue rents or other parts of the district? Higher, lower, comparable?

Response: This is another one I don’t have an answer to yet and is probably best answered by the BID. Another question is what do the leases with the current tenants on Fillmore require concerning other/coming tenants? The property owners need to clearly express their retail marketing commitments and strategies.

• Question:  In 20 years of Fillmore as a plaza, has it ever been considered a success or a good plaza? Doesn’t look successful now.

Response: Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. It’s hard to define success. Certainly, it was popular with the public when it was new and when there was ice-skating or summer films but both of those events were paid for by the BID.  When the Tattered Cover and the Wizard’s Chest were located there, the retail seemed strong. My impression is that the retail facing the middle of the mall has not been as noteworthy. And the shops on the West for years were Larry’s Shoes and Wells Fargo Bank.

• Question: Why has Clayton not been more attractive after the street went through? The restaurant place on the west side has been vacant for well more than a year.
•  Question: Why do we think a through street on Fillmore instead of a plaza would help business?   We have through streets throughout our area and still we have many, many empty store fronts? What is the problem? Maybe it’s paid parking and the instant tickets?

Response: I did not know that Clayton is not attractive, but I do know the north-south streets don’t attract as much retail as the east-west streets. That may be because of the length of blocks or it may be because the east-west streets are longer retail streets. The retail gurus think the whole area needs entrances on First Avenue like Clayton or Fillmore because first folks arrive in their cars and then park. Over zealous parking enforcement is a problem but at the same time the paid parking has created more on-street spaces. Parking studies have shown that people prefer first to park on streets, then in open lots, and then in garages. The CCN Bond project creates parking signage. There’s parking for Fillmore off both Detroit and St. Paul, but without an attractive entrance, visitors do not have a desire to stop and park or an easy way to find parking.

• Question: If 78% of businesses and 92% of residents do not want a street through Fillmore Plaza, who is pushing to have the street? If it is the Business Improvement District (BID), who provides the $$ and make-up of the BID? 
• Question: Please explain the disconnect between a) majority of businesses in district support pedestrian only and b) BID Board voting for the street.

Response: The votes at the Cherry Creek North Neighborhood meetings indicate that 80% of those who attended do not want the street. I was surprised by the small number of people that wanted to keep working for a win-win solution.

I have not seen the details of the business survey presented by the neighborhood president at the neighborhood meeting yet.  It was not a neighborhood survey but a survey by a coalition for neighbors and merchants called Friends of Fillmore. The e-mails that I have received from property owners, business owners, merchants, and employees in the district, that input is running about 2 to 1 favoring a hybrid. But when I just look at the e-mails I’ve received from merchants alone it’s more like 50 -50.  A member of Friends of Fillmore told me merchants fear retribution from property owners in terms of rent increases in future leases if they publicly state their position, and BID reps tell me that merchants fear stating their position for fear of retribution from neighborhood customers. One e-mail I received threatened to boycott businesses that support a hybrid street.   The vote of property owners, renters, and residents within the Business Improvement District for the$18 million bond issue was passed by 1 or 2 votes. The ballot language did not promise an auto-free plaza but the informational items did state that the plaza would be upgraded, remaining essentially auto-free.

• Question: Why are there so many nail salons? How has vacancy rate changed over the last 10 to 20 years?

Response: I don’t know. There must be a lot of people getting their nails done.   

I suspect a corollary to this question is why we are losing unique retail. Twenty plus years ago when the Cherry Creek Mall was developed, there was great fear among CCN property/retail owners that the Mall would usurp all of the retail market. As it turns out, the number of shops values, and taxes went up. Plus BID owners pay their BID assessments. And commercial property taxes based on the value of the residential property surrounding the area, which has increased tremendously in the past 20 years. Now the market is beginning to correct the rents, but maybe not quickly enough, while the taxes have not reflected decline in property value. And taxes may not reflect a decline in property value because the area continues to be one of Denver’s best and is a prime location in all of Denver. In the meantime, a lot of the neighborhood retail areas in the rest of Denver as well as “lifestyle malls” like Belmar, not to mention internet sales, have created huge competition. 

• Question: How can Cherry Creek maintain the unique shopping/entertainment area?

Response: That’s the question both neighbors and businesses are asking? It’s a challenge in light of the above answer. And there are probably as many answers as people who ask the question. Areas evolve and need to reinvent themselves to create interest. That’s part of the reason for the Cherry Creek North Bond Improvements. And it was the reason for the creation of the BID in the late 80’s.

• Comment: Tattered Cover would still be a huge drawing card.

Response: No one would argue with that. 

Parking Issues:

• Question: With the number of cars going through, where would they find parking?

Response: Both North Creek and Fillmore Place have parking garages. The North Creek Garage flows to the plaza. The BID and the City of Denver continue to work on parking issues in the district   Denver smart meters are being installed in the Cherry Creek North Business Improvement District in conjunction with the streetscape improvements.

• Question: Who would get the parking revenue on the street and the ticket revenue?

Response: The revenue would go to the City and County of Denver, unless the streets were vacated. Then enforcement as well as revenue would be a BID responsibility.

• Question: Have retail sales dropped throughout Cherry Creek North since the parking kiosks came in?

Response: Retail sales are related more consistently to the economy than parking prices. While retail sales fell in Cherry Creek in the past couple of years, they did not fall as much as in the metro area. Early parking revenue indicated a lot of activities during business hours, meaning people were still coming to Cherry Creek. Empirical evidence suggested that customer parking was more available, but kiosk inconvenience was also evidenced. Customers did not like walking to the kiosks or kiosk inefficiencies. In conjunction with the district’s bond improvements, the City of Denver will be installing “smart meters.”

Fire Protection Issues:

• Background: The current /former Fillmore Plaza configuration allows fire access along the east side of the Plaza, New designs (and PUD zoning) that bring the buildings forward towards the Plaza preclude that access. Consequently, new designs, both auto-free and auto-access, require access through the center of the area.

• Question: Does there need to be a “road” for fire access?

Response: Yes and no, there does need to be 25 feet for access and that access needs to be clearly visible/defined for firefighters. Further, it must be structured to support fire engines, i.e. not just lawn – although it could be pavement or a grass sort of concrete.

• Question: Is that same 25 foot requirement imposed on the 16^th Street Mall? 

Response: The 16^th Street Mall is all pavement. Fillmore Plaza could be all pavement. According to Chief Joe Gonzales: “The vacation of the 16th Street Mall was approved under specific conditions. The vehicle path on both sides of the center public area, where the benches, trees, etc., are located—must be no less than 9 feet wide to accommodate the wheelbase of fire apparatus, and all surfaces of the vehicles paths and the center area must be structurally capable of supporting fire apparatus loading (impact and longitudinal) in accordance with Section 1607 of Denver’s Building Code Amendments.  The overall width of the surface area that will support fire apparatus is approximately 30 feet.  The agreement, which has been in place since the design phase of the 16th Street Mall, was tested during and after the 1985 Masonic Building fire, when, to effectively position fire aerial apparatus on the 16th Street Mall, trees were cut “

• Question: The Denver Botanic Gardens proposed a green roof for its parking structure?   Why wouldn’t something similar work on Fillmore?   

Not sure why they did not implement a green roof at DBG. 

Response: The Fire Department would approve an application called “grass-crete.” It seems the application is best for cars and not aesthetics or public enjoyment. 

• Question: Would the 25’ fire lane have to be in the center? 

Response: I don’t think so.

Process

• Question: Since the CCN BID has already voted to support a street on Fillmore, isn’t the vote tonight a moot point?

Response: It’s a chicken and an egg situation. Why have the meeting if the BID had chosen not to pursue the “hybrid” street option? Further, the concept can still evolve and as your Council representative, eventually I will have to vote on the issue. So your input does matter.

Other Comments from the CCNNA meetings:

• I am in favor of the hybrid proposal because:
  • “Grassy” Plaza concept hasn’t worked.
  • Definition of insanity – doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome.
  • We need to move forward with vision.
• The Kansas City Country Club Plaza area has no plazas, may I comment?
• Since construction finished, Fillmore has less amenities than it did before! If you would just do improvements promised, people would come! Some of us still use it now!
• It would seem that the hybrid model would actually preclude some features that could really make Fillmore Plaza special, e.g., first class water feature.